Ready to start learning to fix my Fiat...what's step one?

[Klayfish]

Alright, I think I'm about ready to get my hands dirty and have a go at teaching myself how to fix cars. If you didn't get to see my story in the "Introductions" forum, in a nutshell....I'm a car nut who never learned how to fix cars. Done plenty of oil changes, but that's it. Always wanted to learn. Found a local guy selling a pair of '76 Spiders, bought them both. They've both been in indoor storage for about 6 or 7 years. Got them both home and I'm ready to go.

This is the car I'm going to start with. http://s1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa4 ... %20Spider/ The body is certainly rusty, but the interior and motor are more assembled than the other car. My goal with this car is to learn...not restore, completely rebuild, etc.... I just want to be able to say "I got it to run", that would be a big accomplishment for me. I've got all the parts that are off the car. So, with that said, is there a certain order I should go about putting it back together? Besides putting it back together, I know that since it's been sitting for years, I'll need to change the oil and drop the fuel tank to have a look inside.

Sorry it seems like a stupid question, but I was outside looking at the car saying "OK, what do I do first?" I've got a Haynes manual and a good digital camera to try to help me, and I'll certainly ask questions as I begin. So what would you say step one is in the process of bringing the old girl back to life?

Thanks.

[divace73]

Hi Klayfish

I would love to be able to get my hands on 2 spiders...

If everything mechanical is intact, I'd do a (major) service which includes (as a minimum, others feel free to add) and in no specific order
Timing belt and tensioner bearing (<- this is important, if it is really old and breaks while running, you can cause serious damage)
Alternator belt
Engine oil and filter
Spark plugs
Point (if still on the car) rotor button, rotor cap
Spark plug leads
Air filter
Radiator flush out and change coolant.
Gearbox oil
Diff oil
Check condition of Battery, ensure it is good.

[bwilson27]

Get under that car and look at the front shock towers, check for rust.
Check the firewall, is it rusty or bulgy anywhere?
Look closely at the floorpan, esp. under the gas pedal... Any holes?
Obviously you'll need to weld in new outer fender flares in the rear.
Look at the "frame" where the steering idler arm bolts on... Make sure it looks good and not rusty or crumbly.

Long story short- Make sure all your main suspension areas are not rotted out. You can replace everything on the car, but these areas need to be decent before you go doing anything else.
Get a welder.
Have fun.

[Klayfish]

Thanks guys. Sorry, I probably should have clarified more in my post. I don't want to restore this car, or even really make it a driver. I'm a complete novice at fixing cars, I just want to start by learning some basic engine mechanics. This car is probably best served as a parts car. The other one I have is in better condition, and down the road that one may be the one I actually try to get on the road. But it's more disassembled than this red one. So I just want to use this red car as practice to learn wrench turning. At this point, I don't intend to ever drive it on the road. I'd like to try to get the engine to start, as the first step in getting my feet wet in mechanics. There are some parts that were taken off, such as the radiator. Here are a couple of pictures of the engine, the rest of them are in the link on my original post.

I hope my thinking isn't off base. But I know enough that this car would take much more work than I'm capable of right now to make a good driver, so I want to use it almost as a "test subject" and just get the engine to run. At that point, I may part it out or scavange it for the parts I want on the other car. So here are the pics, there are more engine shots in the other link at the top. This was the cool thing about getting 2 Spiders, I can use one as a test car before trying more detailed things....

[azruss]

From the pictures you sent, it look complete withthe exception of the radiator.
Here is what I would do.
put the tranny in neutral and see if you can push it and get it to roll. this will tell you if the clutch is rusted to flywheel and you arent trying to move everything. Once that is done and the car rolls without the engine twisting on the mounts, remove the plugs, get yourself a big socket that fits the crankshaft bolt and try turning the motor over with a wrench. (first make sure there is oil in the motor). Once this is accomplished, clean and gap the plugs and put them back in.
Next take the cap of the dizzy. Look at the condition of the cap and rotor and scrape off any rust or corrosion with a knife. If it has points, clean the contacts and gap it properly . It looks to me like it is an electronic ignition, so ignore the point part and look at the wires under the rotor to see if they look ok. If they are corroded you will need to replace the mag pickup.
Next pull the aircleaner off and start pushing levers on the carb to see if all the butterflies open and arent stuck. if things are stiff, get some spray lubricant and spray the thing down good.
next get under the back and see if you have a fuel filter. disconnect the fuel line from the fuel filter and drain the gas tank. this may require several containers. If the filter looks bad, replace it and put new gas in the tank. save some of the gas to splash in the carb. next, get a battery and see if the motor turns over with the starter. If it turns over and doesnt start, you can splash a small amount of fuel down the carb while someone is cranking on the starter. keep hands and face away from the carb. dont want to be in the way of a back fire.
This is the absolute bare bones basics. If any of the above cant be accomplished then you will need to fix that specific issue before you continue.
Plan B is to see if the brakes work and have someone tow you slowly down the street and see if you get really lucky and it will start.
Good luck

[So Cal Mark]

that's a pretty good procedure, but before turning the motor over I'd remove the spark plugs and pour a capful of ATF in each cylinder and let it sit overnight. I wouldn't worry about putting a radiator in to just fire it for a minute.

[Klayfish]

Thanks for the detailed description, that's perfect!! I already know that the car will roll freely, we pushed it out of the barn and onto my tow dolly, then off my dolly and into the spot it's in now. It rolled with no troubles, and we were able to put it in gear and take it out to allow it to roll.

I'm going to use those steps as an outline. I'll take pics along the way and post questions if I get confused. A few follow up questions on that...and again, forgive me if they're dumb questions, but I'd rather be sure....

Not that I want to create a ton of extra work for myself right off the bat, but should I be concerned about dirt/rust/debris floating in the gas tank? Will draining it get most of it out?

Before I crank the motor by hand, should I check to make sure the timing is fairly accurate, so I don't have pistons hitting valves? If so, how do I check?

It's got the timing belt on, but isn't there a "V belt" that needs to go on, for the alternator, etc...? or can I just try to fire the engine for a few seconds without it?

What's the correct gap for the plugs? I tried to research it, but saw answers from .27 to .35. If I go .30, will that work for my purposes?

Once I've got these steps accomplished and the engine fires up, then I'll try to put the radiator and everything else back in it so that the engine can start and stay running (again...just in my driveway, not ready to try moving it).

[bobplyler]

Just because it rolls in neutral, doesn't mean the clutch isn't rusted to the flywheel.

I've found that jacking up the rearend, starting the car in 5th gear, then pressing in the clutch and putting on the brakes will break the clutch free.

This happens to my car when it sits for several months and it's rainy.

[Raze]

Hey Klay!

Good to see you made it over here (from GRM). These guys really know it all about Spiders, are real friendly, and can definitely help motivate you! Enjoy wrenching!

-Jeff

[CajunMike]

Not that I want to create a ton of extra work for myself right off the bat, but should I be concerned about dirt/rust/debris floating in the gas tank? Will draining it get most it).

Just to get it fired up and to make sure there is fresh gas, go down to a local auto zone and pick up a cheap filter and two 7' lengths of hose that are similar size as the line into the carb and the fuel tank return line from the carb. The fuel lines are metric but a standard size should be fine if it's similar diameter. The carb inflow line is larger than the return line.

Pick up a 1 gallon gas can and fill with high octane fuel. Run the fuel intake line from the gas can to the fuel pump then between the fuel pump and carb install your new filter. You can just plug the intake line into the pressure regulator that is just before the fuel pump intake. Next run the return line from the carb back into the gas can. Make sure you also run the return line!

The cost of hoses is minimal maybe $15. The filter maybe $5 and can be used again. Worry about the gas tank later.

[Red76]

If I can throw in my 2 cents worth:
Take pics!
I'm no expert but I have found if I'm going to take it apart and I'm not sure....
Take pics as you go so when you get to that "Now Where Did This Part Go" you will have something to fall back on.
Again, I'm no expert but it always helps me.

[majicwrench]

Worriying about the clutch froze to flywheel is not an issue at this point.
Is timing belt in one piece?? Not really loose? Go ahead and crank motor by hand. Before you pull plugs, if possible, blow debris out from around plugs or it will drip into cylinder. Remove plugs, no worry about gap, any gap will get it running. Add some lube to cylinders.
Hook up battery see if it spins.
Dont worry bout the v belt or the radiator at this point.
I would not worry bout gas tank, at this point either.. When you are all ready to try it, you can either hook up a seperate line and can or just dribble some fuel down the carb.
Got glasses on?? A FIRE EXTINGUISHER????
Crank engine, see if it starts. If it does start and doens't knock drasticly, shut it off. Running 5-10 seconds not gonna hurt anything. Now LOTS of things to do!!

[Klayfish]

Yep, got safety glasses. There's even a fire extinguisher mounted in the trunk of this car... I'll have a fully charged on one hand.

Have a good digital camera to take lots of pics.

I'll double check the timing belt to make sure it's not really dry rotted/frayed and is nice and tight. I'd hate to "assume" anything, how should I double check to make sure the timing is right before I try to crank it by hand?

What kind of lube should I put into the cylinders?

Yep, there is so much I can do once I get it running. I'll have to balance that with not spending too much, as I'm focusing on my goal of using this car as a learning tool.

[So Cal Mark]

when you turn it by hand, merely stop if you feel resistance

[majicwrench]

As Mark already mentioned, a bit of ATF down cylinders is good, let it sit overnight. Really, anything down cylinders would work, engine oil, WD 40 etc.
In the pics your belt look OK, can still see printing on back.
Give er heck