Lots of Smoke, Stuff on the Engine - pics and questions

[fiasco]

Ok, so my car smokes. And like the surgeon general says, smokin' is bad. So I'm trying to figure out why it's smoking. First, I ruled out peer pressure, insidious ad campaigns by big tobacco companies and battle fatigue.

Then I noticed that I have a leak in the upper radiator hose which sometimes results in big splatters of coolant on things like the timing belt shield and top of the radiator. So the next time I caught Scoobie (that's the car's name - and yes, it has changed a couple times since the SuperStrut, but that's a story for another thread) smoking, which was after a couple miles on the freeway, I stopped in a parking lot, popped the hood and took a look.

That was when I discovered copious amounts of smoke coming off the exhaust pipe underneath the engine bay, along with coolant splatters, which led me to suppose that maybe the coolant is leaking out of the upper radiator hose, running down through the engine bay and dripping onto the exhaust pipe, creating lots-o-smoke.

So today, when I caught her smoking again after a short drive home from work, I took a second look. Still lots of smoke coming off the exhaust pipe, but no real evidence of additional coolant leakage (the engine was still pretty cool), though something was clearly dripping down out of the engine bay and onto the exhaust pipe and the ground. So I backed her up, and gave the little puddle she left on the ground a sniff. Smelled like oil, not like coolant.

I was surprised, becuase while she has always used a little oil, it never seemed like it was so much that I would have suspected that oil was just running out onto the exhaust pipe like I saw today.

So here are some pics of the underside of the car. They show the place on the exhaust pipe where all the smoke was coming from.







And here are some pics of the engine itself.

The first shows the engine block from above on the pass side. It looks like it is wet all over, but the roads were dry so it's not road water. Is this oil all over the engine? Coolant? Something else entirely?


The second is from above and shows to place where I consistently have pools of fluid of some kind.


So I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts. I'm going to go ahead and replace all the coolant hoses. TulsaSpider suggested I replace the thermostat too, but apparently I have an internal thermostat, so I don't even know how to get to it. Where should I start looking for my oil leaks, what's the best approach to dealing with them?

Thanks,
-- se

[danaspider]

is it smoke or steam? Big difference in the problem. If oil, as you said you found on the ground, look to see if the exhaust nuts are all tight. If one is loose, and since they do go into the oil races you would and could get oil blowing onto the exhaust and resulting in big smoke.
So can you define what kind of smoke?

Let us know so we can help.

[manoa matt]

Steve,

The first three shots of the engine from underneath: At that location it is most likely oil. There are several places where it could come from, but its hard to tell with the engine, trans, and everything else covered with oil and gunk. The first thing I would do is clean all that off. Engine degreaser and a bunch of rags, simple green and a bunch of rags, engine foam and a pressure washer etc. At that location it could be oil leaking from the steering idler, greese that turns thin from the heat of the exhaust and runs out of the steering linkages. A leak from the oil pan gasket, a leak at the rear main seal, or a leak at the trans input oil seal.

The picture of the passenger side: If its oil it could be comming from the exhaust manifold mounting studs. Check the second stud in from the rear and second in from the front, these stud holes go into the oil galley of the head. It could be the cam box to head gasket, alternatively it could be the cam box to cam cover gasket, but that would be more noticeable. Hopefully its not comming out of the head gasket, very unlikely.

If its coolant it would be commming from a heater hose, a severly internally corroded heater tube, severly internally corroded block freeze plugs, or the head gasket.

Last picture of the head: Most likely oil. If you only find it in the one spot and at the #1 plug, I would suspect the oil cap gasket. Although the cam box to head gasket is prone to failure. Also another problematic area is the cam cover gaskets.

Clean the car the best you can and then drive around the block a few times, after that you should be able to tell where its comming from.

[pope]

Spend a $1.50 and go to a manual car wash, lay on the ground on both sides of the car and spray all that stuff away. A clean engine will tell you where it is coming from.

[So Cal Mark]

those photos are mostly oil leaks and as Matt wrote, can be from several different spots.
As for hoses, I have hose kits in stock that have all 4 large hoses.

[TulsaSpider]

Steve, mine looked pretty much just like that! My upper exhaust studs had been replaced with bolts. When I changed out my head gasket I found this out and sealed the threads. Also if your vapor separator is clogged it will pressurize the crankcase and send out oil everywhere it can find a way out.. Check out this topic on the same subject and I am sure there are other threads http://www.fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=4916
After I cleaned the separator and sealed the exhaust bolts I have no more leaking!
If you really want the area clean I would suggest picking up a few cans of brake cleaner, just don't do it in an are you want to keep clean! or get losts of cardboard... and keep it away from painted surfaces, after you have finished wait a few minutes for it to evaporate before re-starting the engine. When locating the leaks after cleaning, use a bright flashlight to pinpoint the leaks and be careful of hot surfaces!.
If you have leaks on the right side check the separator hoses, they are located just above the dipstick, two hoses connected to a round thing (separator) just above the fuel pump. Look carefully around there if you see oil, the little hose or the big hose that leads up to the air cleaner could be cracked, you can't really tell by looking. For the longest time I thought the dipstick was leaking on mine but it turned out it was the little hose.
Good luck!

[fiasco]

All right. Cleaning I can do - I've even got quarters that I can put in the car wash thingy. Hoses I can buy and replace. That's two down without much trouble.

So here are my questions:
1) Exhaust studs - are we talking about where the exhaust manifold bolts onto the side of the engine?
2) Vapor separator - what is it and where is it? (also curious about what it does, but don't know if that's relevant to my immediate problem)
3) Brake cleaner - are you saying that I would use it to clean up the engine in place of some other kind of engine cleaner/degreaser, or is there some other use you are suggesting that I'm just not understanding?
4) Matt - all that stuff you suggest at the end of your first paragraph I'll consider phase II and hope the investigation never gets that far.

[So Cal Mark]

1. the two highest studs that bolt the exhaust manifold to the head can leak
2. the vapor separator is on the left side of the block, below the intake manifold. It is just above and fwd of the fuel pump
3. brake cleaner will work, as will oven cleaner or other degreasers

[TulsaSpider]

Brake cleaner is a extremely fast and effective way to clean any greasy part that's not painted, engine included.
There's a hose that connects to your breather and runs down to the vapor separator. Basically it allows vapor from the crankcase to vent to the outside, sort of a PCV system. If it's clogged up or the hoses are cracked, then it leaks or allows the crankcase to pressurize forcing out oil at any vulnerable location. Have you looked at your oil cap where you fill the oil? My seal was shot so inspect that while you are at it. A new one is cheap and it gets messy if you get oil in those spark plug recession etc...

[ga.spyder]

Steve,
I have been chasing a leak in the same location,although mine doesnt appear to be as bad.I have done alot of the suggested items(cleaned seperator,oil cap gasket,tightened ex. studs)..still there.I am starting to suspect rear main seal on mine.It is just a drip,but land right on the exhaust.I hate that smell!! Change one item ,then check for leak,then clean engine again. Repeat Good Luck

[manoa matt]

Lots of smoke = oil burning Sticky sweet smell = coolant burning

In the event your leaks are leading you to the area between the engine and trans. First snug up the oil pan bolts, but don't over do it. If the gasket is pinching or bulging out, it can make it worse. If you take that sheet metal cover off the bottom of the trans bell housing you can differentiate between leaks at the trans and at the rear main seal. If the trans input seal is leaking it will run down the sloped part of the bell housing and pool at the flat spot on the bottom, but a trans input leak would never make it to the exhaust pipe. If you look at the back side of the flywheel and see radial splatter or drips then it could be the rear main seal.

The oil filled steering idlers are prone to leaking out of the bottom oil seal. The oil will run down the pitman arm then down onto the center linkage where it will drop off onto the exhaust. Make sure you clean the idler and steering linkages too. The heat from the exhaust only exacerbates the problem by thinning out the oil and putting the oil seal through heat cycling that ultimately hardens it.