"Court" topic and recent issues

[Site Owner]

All involved -
I deleted this "Court" thread in addition to another recent thread that in my opinion, is getting out of hand.
This site is for sharing useful information about Fiat Spider automobiles and not personal grudge matches.
I'll ask that this matter end right here - please, no more posts on the topic.

In addition, I want to remind everyone here that this site is not a commercial venture and is privately owned by me alone. There is no obligation to join this site and I reserve the right to terminate membership of any person, any topic,post, or even the board and domain itself at any time I see fit or for any reason.

This site has been online for 14 years, and 95% of the time it serves the purpose for which it was intended quite well with little need for my intervention - which is a good thing because I don't have the time for it. Which brings me to Mark, the moderator that has helped this site more than I can describe, without compensation, for most of these 14 years. I know Mark, I trust him, and I certainly appreciate all that he does up here for everyone's benefit. He does this on a completely voluntary basis. I can assure you that this site would be overrun with hackers, spammers, and other undesirable types without Mark's constant diligence. I realize he has a related business and I believe he has conducted himself in a very appropriate manor over the years.

To close here, I'll just say that there is a large community of regulars on this site that have been here since the beginning. I consider you folks "old friends" we've been together up here a long time and I hold those relationships through this site in high regard. I don't even own one of these cars, I did (the one in the header) but I sold it close to 10 years ago. I pay for, and keep this site online for the Spider community - you folks. I won't tolerate people that come in here and cause me trouble as owner of this domain. So let's get back to the primary topic, which is helpful info on this car. If you have a beef with someone, or someone's business - take it offline.

Thanks,
Evan,
Owner of FiatSpider.com





I'll also remind everyone here that by using this site you have agreed to these terms below:

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[MNspiderman]

Thank You

[fiasco]

Thank you.

[MNspiderman]

No. Thank You

[Nancy1340]

Another "Thank You".

[maytag]

Yeah! What HE said!

Thank You!

and thank you, Evan and Mark, for all the work you put into making Fiat Spider ownership a little more feasible, and even more enjoyable.

Somebody once pointed-out to me that racing a Ducati (at the club-level) was impossible without the internet.... I'd say the same is true of Fiat Spider-ing......

[manoa matt]

So... If someone out there in the general public, or a forum member for that matter that preys on Fiat spider owners, giving false promises, taking peoples money, missrepresenting themselves, etc... We as concerned citizens/fiat owners can't warn other potential victoms about them through this site? It's Ok to let people continue to be duped?

What's the point of having a "forum" if there is not an open and honest discussion without censorship?

"I want to remind everyone here that this site is not a commercial venture and is privately owned by me alone."
Does this mean that every time you don't agree with someone elses view the post is deleted? I think all spiders should be painted orange, what color do you like?

While you are deleting posts, here are a few that you might not agree with:
http://www.fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic ... it=caribou
http://www.fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic ... it=caribou
http://www.fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic ... it=caribou

If it's fear that you personally will be sued because of a members post is liable/slanderous, then re-write the disclaimer to something like "The views and opinions expressed on this forum are those of the members and in no way reflect the views and opinions of the site owner."

I hope I can still log in later.

[Site Owner]

"So... If someone out there in the general public, or a forum member for that matter that preys on Fiat spider owners, giving false promises, taking peoples money, missrepresenting themselves, etc... We as concerned citizens/fiat owners can't warn other potential victoms about them through this site? It's Ok to let people continue to be duped?"

So Matt, I did think about that. I don't like scammers and other similar ilk any more than you or most other reasonable people. And you make a valid point here. The problem is that with the size and influence that this site has in this very close knit community of Spider Owners around the globe really, there exists a potential for the site to act as a "court" of sorts. Often passing ungrounded judgments on people. I am not saying that's the situation in this particular case at all, but the potential is there. There are many other legitimate means of taking care of dishonest businesses, posers, scammers, etc. This site doesn't need to fill that role. That's for the BBB, lawyers and law enforcement. If anyone on this forum feels the need to "warn" someone, be my guest to do that through a private message or e-mail - I've got no problem with that. What I have a problem with is when this stuff gets out of hand and I get bothered with e-mails and it takes up my time. This stuff gets whipped up into a frenzy and falls outside of the intention I have for this site. If people insist on spinning up this kind of activity, they can do it on someone else's web site, not mine.

"Does this mean that every time you don't agree with someone elses view the post is deleted? I think all spiders should be painted orange, what color do you like?"

A little smart ass on your part, but ok, to answer your question: No, I wouldn't delete a post simply because I don't agree with someone's view, unless it bothered me enough to and then I would. And to be equally smart ass right back at ya, if you don't like that answer, start your own forum. I'm not going to delete a post where someone is debating who makes a better tire, shock absorber, top, whatever. I will delete a post where someone starts going off on someone else in a personal manor, or starts a discussion or debate that I don't think belongs on my site. It's my decision to make. You can ask any old timer here and they will tell you that I have done very little intervention or heavy-handed moderating on this site over the past 14 years. Bottom line, it is my site and if I see something that bothers me enough, I'll delete it. Same goes for any member that bothers me enough. I can count on one hand the number of people I've banned over 14 years. But I'm gettin' old and cratchity, so my patience ain't what it used to be. And yes, you can still log on, unless you pass my tolerance threshold

[fiasco]

Determining when a thread has gone over the line is a judgement call and is up to the site owner and moderator. It always has been and always will be. That's not an easy task for someone who is trying to give people an opportunity to discuss what they want, but also keep things from getting out of hand.

This is a moderated forum. That's why we have a moderator. If it were an open forum, there would be no question of moderation, and no one would get banned, and no threads would get locked or deleted. I've been on forums like that, and I hate them. That's one of the things that I like about this forum.

Is there a possibility that a topic I am passionate about might get booted? Yes. Is there a possibility that I might get booted if I get too passionate about a topic. Yes. If I ever come to the conclusion that that creates an unacceptable dynamic on the forum, I will stop participating. For me, the little that I give up by participating in a moderated forum is far less significant than what I would have to endure on an open forum.

So, again, thank you Evan for stepping in and doing what you believe is right. And especially thank you to Mark for walking the difficult line of being a moderator. I appreciate the opportunity that the two of you give to the rest of us, and I do not begrudge you the right to make the hard decisions when you believe it's necessary.

-- se

[Site Owner]

Well said. Thank you Steve. Really Steve brings up a good point - can you imagine the amount of literal trash that would be on this site if it weren't for Mark, myself and a good number of dedicated regulars keeping an eye on it?

Thanks Steve

[beachboy]

Evan showed up and saw his shadow, so 6 more weeks of summer.

"As a user you agree to any information you have entered to being stored in a database. While this information will not be disclosed to any third party without your consent,"

I guess you dont consider Google a third party? You allow Google to come in and sweep your servers. All the database can be accessed from a Google search, yet no-one has consented. I have had businesses do a name search on me and found out through Google my FiatSpider posts. Thanks

The reason I bring this up is that there are several written rules, that are fractured on the site by the owner and moderator yet there are trotted out as gospel to the let-them-eat-cake crowd. Your gonna do what you want to do anyways, so why wave the stone tablets at us. And of course you dont compensate Mark, that would be a pay cut compared to the nice gig he has here worked out for himself.
Also, of the old times, half have left in the last year and the other half have significantly cut their involvement.

[Site Owner]

Beachboy -
"Also, of the old times, half have left in the last year and the other half have significantly cut their involvement."

Strange how the site has more than doubled in membership and posting activity in that same period. The people that I was referring to are still here and very active. Speaking of active, you sure are active in a site you seem to dislike so much. If you don't like the way I run my web site, then leave. It's that simple.